(#i6qqvqq) @movq@www.uninformativ.de Right. That’s why, I’d bite the bullet and go for huge URLs. :-)

I havent’t looked at the code and I’m too lazy right now, does jenny also verify the fetched result against the hash?

(#ucgvfmq) @movq@www.uninformativ.de Yeah, but hashing also uses the main feed URL or whatever is written in the feed’s first url metadata field. So, it’s not a new problem, it’s exactly the same.

(#l5452vq) @lyse@lyse.isobeef.org indeed! There is no “central authority” acting as witness, and notary. The more I think of it… LOL.

(#2p5ulxq) @movq@www.uninformativ.de @david@collantes.us Yeah, he got a bit older but I could still easily recognize him.

(#l5452vq) Another thing: At the moment, anyone could claim that some feed contained a certain message which was then removed again by just creating the hash over the fake message in said feed and invented timestamp themselves. Nobody can ever verify that this was never the case in the first place and completely made up. So, our twt hashes have to be taken with a grain of salt.

(#i6qqvqq) @david@collantes.us Cool idea actually! The hash would also be shorter than the raw URL and timestamp.

(#l5452vq) @prologic@twtxt.net I get where you’re coming from. But is it really that bad in practice? If you follow any link somewhere in the web, you also don’t know if its contents has been changed in the meantime. Is that a problem? Almost never in my experience.

Granted, it’s a nice property when one can tell that it was not messed with since the author referenced it.

(#ucgvfmq) @movq@www.uninformativ.de The more I think about it, the more do I like the location-based addressing. That feels fairly in line with the spirit of twtxt, just like you stated somewhere else.

The big downside for me is that the subjects then become super long.

And if the feed relocates, we end up with broken conversation trees again. Just like nowadays. At least it’s not getting worse. :-)

Using the feed URL in there might become a little challenging for new folks, when the twt rotates away into archive feeds. But I reckon, we already have a similar situation with the hashes. So, probably not too bad.

(#uvc5xea) @quark@ferengi.one Yeah, let’s see what they reveal!

(#2p5ulxq) @movq@www.uninformativ.de I recognise him, but yes, he has aged quite a bit. I mean, I look at myself in the mirror and can’t, often, recognise myself. Ageing is a bitch! 😅

(#sjak2ta) Nice, @david@collantes.us! The winter palms look nice. And the sky is full of snow.

Yesterday, both temperature and wind picked up. There was even wind in the night, which is rare over here. Today, we also got a lot of sunshine, around 22°C and heaps of wind. The leaves and twigs were blown at the house door, it reminded me of a snow drift, basically a leave bank. I should have taken a photo before I swept it, it looked quite bizarre.

But I photographed something else instead:

My mate and I went out in the woods earlier and we came across 08 which broke off in roughly 6, 7 meters from 09. When it hit the ground, it made a 30 cm deep hole. Quite impressive. https://lyse.isobeef.org/waldspaziergang-2024-09-19/

(#pgi2jkq) I mean, really, it couldn’t get any better. I love it!

(#pgi2jkq) @movq@www.uninformativ.de perfect in every way. Configurable too! Thank you!

(#pgi2jkq) @movq@www.uninformativ.de yes, that’s perfect! <3

(#vq422aa) @eldersnake@we.loveprivacy.club I wanted to ask you, are you running Headscale and WireGuard on the same VPS? I want to test Headscale, but currently run a small container with WireGuard, and I wonder if I need to stop (and eventually get rid of) the container to get Headscale going. Did you use the provided .deb to install Headscale, or some other method?

(#xghlsva) @prologic@twtxt.net I read it. I understand it. Hopefully a solution can be agreed upon that solves the editing issue, whilst maintaining the cryptographic hash.

(#xghlsva) @prologic@twtxt.net I know the role of the current hash is to allow referencing (replies and, thus, threads), and it also represents a “unique” way to verify a twtxt hasn’t been tampered with. Is that second so important, if we are trying to allow edits? I know if feels good to be able to verify, but in reality, how often one does it?

@movq@www.uninformativ.de could it be possible to have compressed_subject(msg_singlelined) be configurable, so only a certain number of characters get displayed, ending on ellipses? Right now the entire twtxt is crammed into the Subject:. This request aims to make twtxts display on mutt/neomutt, etc. more like emails do.

(#3f36byq) @prologic@twtxt.net I don’t trust Google with anything, sorry, pass. Oh, and you need to sign in on your Google Account (or whatever they call it these days).

(#xghlsva) @prologic@twtxt.net how about hashing a combination of nick/timestamp, or url/timestamp only, and not the twtxt content? On edit those will not change, so no breaking of threads. I know, I know, just adding noise here. :-P

(#qgv3waq) @eldersnake@we.loveprivacy.club there has to be less reliance on a single point of failure. It is not so much about creating jobs in the US (which come with it, anyway), but about the ability to produce what’s needed at home too. What’s the trade off? Is it going to be a little bit more expensive to manufacture, perhaps?

(#xghlsva) @quark@ferengi.one It does not. That is why I’m advocating for not using hashes for treads, but a simpler link-back scheme.

(#kdtce4q) @prologic@twtxt.net :-D Thanks! Things can come in cycles, right? This is simply another one. Another cycle, more personal than the other “alter egos”.

(#kdtce4q) @aelaraji@aelaraji.com hey, hey! You are my very first reply! 👋🏻 Cheers!

Incredibly upset—more than you could imagine—because I already made the first mistake, and corrected it (but twtxt.net got it on it’s cache, ugh!) :‘-( . Can’t wait for editing to become a reality!

Alright. My first mentions—which were picked not so randomly, LOL—are @prologic@twtxt.net, @lyse@lyse.isobeef.org, and @movq@www.uninformativ.de. I am also posting my first image too, which you see below. That’s my neighbourhood, in a “winter” day. Hopefully @prologic@twtxt.net will add my domain to his allowed list, so that the image (and any other further) renders.

(#kikq2xa) Alright, announce_me set to true. Now, who do I pick to be my first mention? Decisions, decisions. Next twtxt will have my first mention(s). :-)

I have configured my twtxt.txt as simple as possible. I have setup a publish_command on jenny. Hopefully all works fine, and I am good to go. Next will be setting the announce_me to true. Here we go!

Everything starts at a “hello world”. At least around these parts; the nerdy parts.

(#5vbi2ea) @falsifian@www.falsifian.org Yeah, delete requests feel very odd.

(#y2t2tnq) @prologic@twtxt.net I wish that was true! But I reckon there is still heaps of old stuff out there, that was created on a Windows machine. :-D And I wouldn’t be surprised if even today in that environment a new file does not make use of UTF-8.

(#bz7aevq) @quark@ferengi.one I’m not convinced. :-D

(#xvlyzfa) @quark@ferengi.one @movq@www.uninformativ.de Yep, they’re all RFC3339. Obviously, +02:00 and +01:00 are best, because I use them! :-P In all seriousness, Z might be the best timezone, as it is shortest. And regarding privacy, it leaks the least information about the user’s rough location. But of course, one can just look at the activity and narrow down plausible regions, so that’s a weak argument.

(#y2t2tnq) @falsifian@www.falsifian.org I can confirm, it’s fixed. Thank you! Indeed, this is some wild quoting.

I still do not understand why the encoding suddenly broke, though. :-? Anyway. I concentrate on my rewrite and do things the right™ way. ;-) Still long ways to go.

(#hwv7iya) @bender@twtxt.net I know, I know… A relative time in a static HTML document is questionable at best. ;-)

(#xzgj32a) Now WTF!? Suddenly, @falsifian@www.falsifian.org’s feed renders broken in my tt Python implementation. Exactly what I had with my Go rewrite. I haven’t touched the Python stuff in ages, though. Also, tt and tt2 do not share any data at all.

By any chance, did you remove the ; charset=utf-8 from your Content-Type: text/plain header, falsifian?

(#qlgshhq) @movq@www.uninformativ.de Non-ASCII characters were broken. Like U+2028, degrees (°), etc.

Turns out I used a silly library to detect the encoding and transform to UTF-8 if needed. When there is no Content-Type header, like for local files, it looks at the first 1024 bytes. Since it only saw ASCII in that region, the damn thing assumed the data to be in Windows-1252 (which for web pages kinda makes sense):

// TODO: change default depending on user's locale?
return charmap.Windows1252, "windows-1252", false

https://cs.opensource.google/go/x/net/+/master:html/charset/charset.go;l=102

This default is hardcoded and cannot be changed.

Trying to be smart and adding automatic support for other encodings turned out to be a bad move on my end. At least I can reduce my dependency list again. :-)

I now just reject everything that explicitly specifies something different than text/plain and an optional charset other than utf-8 (ignoring casing). Otherwise I assume it’s in UTF-8 (just like the twtxt file format specification mandates) and hope for the best.

Hmmmm, I somehow run into an encoding problem where my inserted data end up mangled in the database. But, both SQLite and Go use UTF-8. What’s happening here? :-?

(#kshd6sq) @prologic@twtxt.net Correct. :-D

(#r4msqlq) @prologic@twtxt.net I’m basically with @movq@www.uninformativ.de, but in contrast to him, I’m not looking forward to implement something like that. :-)

A feed URL is plenty good enough for me. Since I only fetch feeds that I explicity follow, there is some basic trust in those feeds already. Spoofing, impersonation and what not are no issues for me. If I were to find out otherwise, I just unsubscribe from the evil feed. Done.

To retrieve public feeds, I just rely on TLS. Most are served via HTTPS. If a feed is down, I’m not trying to fetch it from some other source, I just wait and try again later. So signed messages/feeds are not a use case I’m particularly benefitting from.

To me, it’s just not worth at all adding this crypto complexity on top.

(#t2kaoma) Found it: https://github.com/buckket/twtxt/issues/157

(#kshd6sq) @prologic@twtxt.net Yeah, but I reckon we can kill both birds with one stone. If we change it to support edits, it should be fairly easy to also tweak it to support feed URL changes. Like outlined in my first reply: https://twtxt.net/twt/n4omfvq The URL part sounds way easier to me. :-)

(#q5p74va) @sorenpeter@darch.dk There was or maybe still is a competing proposal for multiline twts that combines all twts with the same timestamp to one logical multiline twt. Not sure what happened to that, if it is used in the wild and whether anyone “here” follows a feed with that convention. “Our” solution for multiline twts is to use U+2028 Unicode LINE SEPARATOR as a newline: https://dev.twtxt.net/doc/multilineextension.html.

(#wnq5qva) @movq@www.uninformativ.de What’s you definition of “complete thread”? ;-) There might be feeds participating in the conversation that you have no idea of.

But yes, this has a nice discoverability bonus. And even simpler than a hash, that’s right.

(#otqhota) @movq@www.uninformativ.de Yeah, I think so.

(#pvju5cq) Keys for identity are too much for me. This steps up the complexity by a lot. Simplicity is what made me join twtxt with its extensions. A feed URL is all I need.

Eventually, twt hashes have to change (lengthen at least), no doubt about that. But I’d like to keep it equally simple.

(#yudn25q) @prologic@twtxt.net When the next hype train departs. :-)

(#r3mkxya) @stigatle@yarn.stigatle.no Yeah, the sudden drop makes it feel worse than it is. It made me wear a beanie and gloves on my bike ride on Friday evening. In a few weeks I consider the same temperatures not an issue anymore, maybe even nicely warm. ;-) The body is fairly quick to adopt, but not that fast.

I just saw that we’re supposed to hit 19°C mid next week again. Let’s see.

(#54t2ohq) @off_grid_living@twtxt.net Oh dear, what an epic adventure! Terrible at the time, but hilarious to tell later on. :-D

I do like this photo a lot. It brings up memories of cool scouting trips.